Khmelnitski Proskurov

[Question Everything]

Does anyone have more info on this picture, like a higher resolution version or what exactly it shows? Is it allegedly showing Germans with people executed naked (why naked?) or Soviets having uncovered/discovered said grave (victims still not decomposed, no shot wounds visible)?

I think I have an even lower resolution version before with as remark that people shot with machine guns don't look so nice and that bodies are not all that discernible and weird. I just can't remember where exactly. The "picture" looks like a painted over version of an extract of what might have been in the full movie, excerpts of which below in a YouTube video of a mass grave at Kharkov. Check at 3:52 minutes in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4agw5_oi ... W4EO1w1xm0

Berenbaum, Michael. The World Must Know: the history of the Holocaust
as told in the United States Holocaust Museum. ISBN O-316-09135-9 (hc).
First edition 1993.

Page 96. Caption to photo reads:

Mass graves of seven thousand murdered in Khmelnitski Proskurov,
Ukraine, January 1943. _Museum of the Polish Army, Warsaw, Poland._
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/places/ft ... -grave.ref

[Hannover]

The picture is a typical communist cut & paste fake, of which there are many. Notice the tell tale dark border on the sides of the 'pit'.
- no bullet holes
- no blood
- no detailed photos
- no verifiable forensic report
- the official storyline says the German exhumed all the bodies and burnt them so no one could find the bodies, the liars have lost control of their false narrative, can't keep their stories straight

Hannover

[Jerzy Ulicki-Rek]

"the liars have lost control of their false narrative, can't keep their stories straight

Hannover"

And they are back to :


"The fact that Koch had lamps made of human skin, which of course had to be decorated with 'artistic' tattoos, did not distinguish him from the other SS officers: They had the same 'artworks' made for their family homes. It is more interesting that Frau Koch had a lady's handbag made out of the same material. She was just as proud of it as a South Sea island woman would have been about her cannibal trophies."
(...)

"It is apparent that even some of the SS thought that these kinds of things are going too far, because a letter to the Buchenwald Pathology Department asks that the manufacturing of shrunken heads etc. will stop."

http://nizkor.org/features/techniques-o ... -8-01.html


Jerzy

[Hannover]

Jerzy:

We're off topic, but a good one anyway. Laughable indeed.

For a debunking of the 'shrunken heads' nonsense see:
'Shrunken Heads Buchenwald'
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5800&p=46283
excerpt:

Considering the thesis in the video "Buchenwald A Dumb Dumb Portrayal of Evil" that the whole thing was a Psyche Warfare Operation, then the document asking the pathology department to quit making those shrunken heads would have been a Psyche Warfare planted object also. Crafty, quirky disinformation such as this is the kind of thing Psychological Warfare does. The idea that the SS is so terrible but even some in their ranks thought "hey the shrunken heads and curios is going too far." It's funny when you think about it.

If planting a shrunken head and creating a belief in a tattooed skin lampshade, is in the Psyche Warfare realm, then is a paper document also in the realm of something Psyche Warfare might plant?

If in 1943, SS judge Konrad Morgen spent months looking for corruption at Buchenwald, including interviewing inmates and asking them if they'd been sexually assaulted by Ilse Koch, then do you think the SS would just send a note saying "hey cut this out" about something as crazy as human material curios?

http://www.holocaustdenialvideos.com/bu ... index.html

new links:
http://www.onethirdoftheholocaust.com/nazishrunkenheads
and:
http://www.codoh.com/library/document/1529

With the impossible 'holocaust' someone can claim anything about the 'evil' Germans and Jewish supremacists demand that everyone believe it ... or else.

Cheers, Hannover

[Raymond]

I would be more interested in a discussion and to hear members opinions regarding the posted video rather than straying into the land of Ilsa Koch and Buchenwald. Any thoughts?

[Moderator]

I would be more interested in a discussion and to hear members opinions regarding the posted video rather than straying into the land of Ilsa Koch and Buchenwald. Any thoughts?

Raymond:
Good idea. Go ahead and watch the video and gives us your impressions. Get the ball rolling.
Thanks, M1

[Raymond]

Fair enough. Unfortunately I do not have speakers on my computer so I do not know what the naration is claiming.

What appears to be shown is dead civilians with the camera focusing on the corpses of women. As with any war torn region, there will be casualties be them legitimate or due to suppression of partisan activities and their supporters and typically those bodies will be disposed of at a central location rather than left sitting around. This would be my first assumption rather than the typical "nazi thugs" line, but I am more interested in fellow forum members thoughts.

[Hannover]

FYI:
The video is in Russian with Italian subtitles.

Good points, Raymond.
I looked at it and it's nothing more than communist propaganda, completely staged. It's so stiff that it's laughable.

- Is this supposed to be Khmelnitski Proskurov and the claim of "70,000 murdered"?
- If you start counting them there is nothing like what is claimed. Nothing even like what is claimed in the video, which absurdly states "14,000".
- No telling if these are Jews? Civilians? Victims of well known communist NKVD actions?
- The mass grave is not verifiable as to it's real location. Something like that could just a well have been Germans killed by the communists. Add a few Russians in uniform next to the site, edit the mass grave site into the rest of the footage, voila!
- If this were a real 'holocaust' site we would be seing it night & day in the media.
- Why hasn't there been a complete, verifiable excavation of the site? We know why.

Hannover

[borjastick]

The bodies in the mass grave and on the surrounding hill seem to be in an advanced stage of decomposition. Therefore they were probably killed 1-2 years prior. Does this fit with the film narrative or claims of any German atrocities?

[Creox]

The bodies in the mass grave and on the surrounding hill seem to be in an advanced stage of decomposition. Therefore they were probably killed 1-2 years prior. Does this fit with the film narrative or claims of any German atrocities?

Yes, in the video but the pic in the op shows a large "patch" of fresh ,naked bodies. Those look pasted in as they are much brighter than the surrounding area. So perhaps that was done to fit the narrative/ claims?

[Hektor]

Does anyone have more info on this picture, like a higher resolution version or what exactly it shows? Is it allegedly showing Germans with people executed naked (why naked?) or Soviets having uncovered/discovered said grave (victims still not decomposed, no shot wounds visible)?
....

Looks like a cut and paste job with photographed drawings to me. But I think one would have to get the negatives and then do further investigations on it.

Who is actually supposed to have taken the picture. The Germans had pretty good cameras during that time and those pictures, that aren't passed on as hard Holocaust proof, are usually pretty sharp and clear black and white pictures, while the Holo-ones are almost all blurry, clumsy ones. This is except the pictures that have been taken in the Western camps, when they took over there.