Himmler's Posen speech of 04 October 1943 - Full version

[EtienneSC]

It is interesting to hear that Himmler says he received an order. Perhaps that is a reference to the Commissar Order.

[Hannover]

It is interesting to hear that Himmler says he received an order. Perhaps that is a reference to the Commissar Order.

Yet we see no such order for claimed general 'exterminations'.
The Commissar Order is not disputed.

- Hannover

[Otium]

As for the claimed later speeches, note that we see only claimed English 'translations' not the original German text.

And it always comes back to the most basic element necessary to back up the claim that Himmler was talking about 'extermination', that being the alleged enormous human remains of millions upon millions said to be in precisely known locations.

Why don't we see verifiable German original text of the speeches?
Why are the alleged immense human remains that are claimed to exist in known locations simply not there?

We know why.

- Hannover

Yeah, you're absolutely right. Those are great points to make. But I think we cannot be satisfied with just that.

I know I'm not.

If revisionism is going to change the hearts and minds of more and more people so the truth can be exposed for what it is, we unfortunately don't in this uphill battle, have the luxury of making statements like these to simply be accepted. We need to go the extra mile in order to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, or at least, provide enough valid skepticism to call the claims into question without the illusion of academic consensus that there's a glaring divide over the physical facts and these supposed speeches. Otherwise, the exterminationists can continue their smear accusations of 'academic laziness' on the part of revisionists when in actuality the arguments you made Hannover, are totally valid. But even though that's the case we cannot expect our opponents to treat us fairly so we thus need the evidence to back it up. So instead of being on the defensive we're on the offensive outright throwing shadows over 'evidence' like this.

We've all seen the Posen speeches thrown around, I see it all the time, and frankly it's a pain in the ass to explain they're highly suspect without branching off onto other topics that steer away conversation from the speeches themselves where the exterminationist can just counter signal to another topic. More so when the later speeches haven't been adequately addressed. And even the first one for that matter.

[Otium]

https://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Posen_speeches Metapedia has some info on the latter speeches but not much. I'm not totally satisfied with it anyway.

[Otium]

It is interesting to hear that Himmler says he received an order. Perhaps that is a reference to the Commissar Order.

What makes you think he was referring to the Commissar Order? Just curious.

[EtienneSC]

What makes you think he was referring to the Commissar Order? Just curious.

The quotation you gave from the speech to the navy: "Thus I have basically given the order to also kill the wives and children of these partisans, and commissars." And the fact that no independent evidence of a more wide-ranging Hitler order has been found, so on the principle of parsimony it would be a reasonable fit. I was just speculating though.

[ServantOfAhuraMazda]

I've heard a lot of theories and wild claims about the Posen speech over the years, but has anyone tried to just listen to other audio recordings of Himmler? I did and I do not think that its Himmler's voice.

Listen to this speech: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File ... der_SS.ogg

And then to the infamous Posen speech: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File ... ,_1943.ogg

I think the Posen speech does not sound like true Himmler at all.