Another Treblinka "Archaeologist"? William Mitchell claims to have "vital evidence to prove the deniers wrong"

[NFrNJ]

The old excuse of 'you can't dig there guvnor' ... is used as a barrier to the truth by jews who know that if you did dig there guvnor, you wouldn't find proof of mass murder etc.

How do you know this? Any evidence for this? Other than supposition?

NFrNJ:

We know it because they say it...

But it seems they do not actually say it. You have no source to confirm that. You have not quoted anyone as saying it. Have you even a single hearsay example to give us?

All you have is speculation based on one possible, but not compelling or even plausible, interpretation of actions.

How do you "know" that they "know that if you dig there you won't find any proof of mass murder"?

You claim to know what they know. Kindly prove that. Or admit that you have no proof and this is just supposition. Not even hearsay.

[Hannover]

NFrNJ:

I remind you yet again to actually read what is in this thread and the links included. References to Jews dodging the fact that there are no claimed remains by asserting that Jew remains cannot be disturbed are common. As I said, 'We know because they say so'.

hint:
"Carolyn Sturdy Colls and the resident Rebbe at Treblinka have claimed that "Jewish Burial Law" absolutely prohibits exhumation of human remains."

And once again, please show us the massive human remains that you claim exist. Your dodging is indicative of your not being able to do what say. However, we are not surprised,

- Hannover

[NFrNJ]

The fact is that these alleged immense mass graves allegedly filled with human remains in allegedly known locations simply do not exist.
Another verifiable fact which demolishes hateful propaganda.

- Hannover

Care to verify this fact?

[NFrNJ]

'but if you find any bodies, you'll have to stop'.

seems to be the only quote in this thread from someone Jewish with any authority.

and does not support Hannover's claim that they say 'we know there are no bodies there so do not dig." Quite on the contrary, he is saying that he wants them locate the mass graves, and having done so, not despoil them.

He fully expects them to find bodies. Or masses of cremated remains.

So again, this does not support the idea that the Jews (who are of course a singular entity who all have a hive mind) oppose the digs because they "know" there are no bodies to find.

Also, can someone point out the exact quotation in which Mr Mitchell says he has "vital evidence to prove the deniers wrong" this does not appear to a quote from him, but an editorial comment.

[Lamprecht]

But it seems they do not actually say it. You have no source to confirm that. You have not quoted anyone as saying it.

William Mitchell has been quoted as saying that he has "vital evidence to prove the deniers wrong" at Treblinka 2.
William Mitchell has been asked to provide such evidence multiple times and refused. Please prove me wrong as I'd like to see his "vital evidence."
He shouldn't even need to be asked, honestly. Why would someone withhold such "vital evidence" when there have been (and still are) individuals in various European countries that have been fined and/or imprisoned for questioning the orthodox "Holocaust" narrative?

A lot of things in history cannot be proven with any high degree of certainty without a time machine. "Eyewitness testimony" and even "confessions" made today are often found to be incorrect - both deliberately or on accident.

Simple question, not rhetorical:
If William Mitchell refuses to show us his alleged "vital evidence to prove the deniers wrong" - why would any sane, reasonable person believe that he actually has any?

[Clay]

William Mitchell:

...As an archaeologist, I have experienced first hand how using a measured, scientific approach to the investigation of these atrocities can help to answer questions... The presentation of rigorously researched scientific evidence to support the known (and sometimes forgotten) history, has become ever more important... I have personally seen and been subject to the unequivocal evidence of the true scale of the Holocaust. I have experienced the profound effects of being presented with the graves and the remains of the victims and have seen the positive effects of presenting the evidence of the research to the public.

Why not start with these questions then Mitchell:

THE HOLOCAUST ARCHAEOLOGY HOAX

Mass Graves / Buried Remains Forensic Evaluation Form

PART ONE

A: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it has been alleged in orthodox historiography and/or the media that huge pits were dug and utilized as mass graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

B: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it has been conclusively proven - with 100% certainty - that huge pits were actually dug and utilized as mass graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

C: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it has been alleged in orthodox historiography and/or the media that mass graves have been discovered by archaeologists / forensic investigators at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

D: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it can be conclusively proven - with 100% certainty - that mass graves have actually been discovered by archaeologists / forensic investigators at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

E: Can you conclusively prove - with 100% certainty - that archaeologists / forensic investigators have actually located / proven the existence of mass graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - Yes. - or - No. - _?_

* * * * *

#1 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#2 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#3 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#4 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#5 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.


#6 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#7 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#8 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pitsin question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#9 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#10 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.


#11 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#12 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#13 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pitsin question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#14 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#15 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.


#16 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#17 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#18 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#19 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#20 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.


#21 - Of the 33 alleged Belzec graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#22 - Of the 21 alleged Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#23 - Of the 7 alleged Ponary graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#24 - Of the 24 alleged Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#25 - Of the 15 alleged Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.


#26 - Of the 100 alleged graves / cremation pits of Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

http://thisisaboutscience.com/

[Clay]

The fact is that these alleged immense mass graves allegedly filled with human remains in allegedly known locations simply do not exist.
Another verifiable fact which demolishes hateful propaganda.

- Hannover

Care to verify this fact?

Care to answer the following simple questionaire NFrNJ?

THE HOLOCAUST ARCHAEOLOGY HOAX

Mass Graves / Buried Remains Forensic Evaluation Form

PART ONE

A: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it has been alleged in orthodox historiography and/or the media that huge pits were dug and utilized as mass graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

B: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it has been conclusively proven - with 100% certainty - that huge pits were actually dug and utilized as mass graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

C: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it has been alleged in orthodox historiography and/or the media that mass graves have been discovered by archaeologists / forensic investigators at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

D: Is it - True. - or - False. - that; it can be conclusively proven - with 100% certainty - that mass graves have actually been discovered by archaeologists / forensic investigators at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - _?_

E: Can you conclusively prove - with 100% certainty - that archaeologists / forensic investigators have actually located / proven the existence of mass graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II - Yes. - or - No. - _?_

* * * * *

#1 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#2 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#3 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#4 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.

#5 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove actually exist and currently contain at least an iota of human remains: __?__.


#6 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#7 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#8 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pitsin question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#9 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.

#10 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 2 human beings: __?__.


#11 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#12 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#13 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pitsin question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#14 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.

#15 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of more than 6 human beings: __?__.


#16 - List all of the Belzec graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#17 - List all of the Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#18 - List all of the Ponary graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#19 - List all of the Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.

#20 - List all of the Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question that you can prove currently contain the remains of at least 21 human beings: __?__.


#21 - Of the 33 alleged Belzec graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#22 - Of the 21 alleged Chelmno graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#23 - Of the 7 alleged Ponary graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#24 - Of the 24 alleged Sobibor graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.

#25 - Of the 15 alleged Treblinka II graves / cremation pits in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.


#26 - Of the 100 alleged graves / cremation pits of Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II in question - the one that you can prove currently contains the most human remains - is number: __?__.


http://thisisaboutscience.com/

[Hannover]

The fact is that these alleged immense mass graves allegedly filled with human remains in allegedly known locations simply do not exist.
Another verifiable fact which demolishes hateful propaganda.

- Hannover

Care to verify this fact?

No problem.

The very fact that no one has been able to show the alleged remains , when it is most definitely in the interest of those who make the claims to do so.

And of course, I have cited examples in this very thread, please pay attention, where teams of True Believers have actually excavated and did not find what is falsely alleged.

So indeed, I can "verify that".

- Hannover

[Clay]

Lamprecht:

These scientific fraudsters will go to these sites, spend weeks producing nothing of value whatsoever, and return to write a "report" containing a drawn map with 10, 20, or even 30 alleged "huge mass graves" but not with a single photograph even one of those pits actually excavated.

Actually,, some of the alleged "huge mass graves" have been excavated and photographed.

The http://www.thisisaboutscience.com/ website is a great source to learn more about this criminally fraudulent archaeological charade:

BELZEC, CHELMNO, PONARY, SOBIBOR and TREBLINKA II

Are the remains of over 2.1 million jews really buried in the 100 alleged mass graves?

It is alleged in orthodox historiography that; during WW II - hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of corpses were buried in numerous “huge mass graves” at Belzec, Chelmno, Ponary, Sobibor and Treblinka II. However, despite all the deceptive allegations to the contrary, the truth is; the largest (in terms of quantity of remains) of the one hundred graves / cremation pits that are alleged to have been “scientifically proven” to currently exist at these sites, in which verified human remains have been tangibly located via bona fide, verifiably honest and conclusively documented archaeology; contained the remains of - ONLY SIX PEOPLE.

http://www.thisisaboutscience.com/

Here is the first photograph linked to in the site that shows two of the excavated "huge mass graves" including "the largest (in terms of quantity of remains) of the one hundred graves / cremation pits that are alleged to have been “scientifically proven” to currently exist at these sites."



I can't wait for NFrNJ to show us a "huge mass grave" that contains the remains of more than 6 people. (He has 98 more to choose from.)

[Lamprecht]

Also, can someone point out the exact quotation in which Mr Mitchell says he has "vital evidence to prove the deniers wrong" this does not appear to a quote from him, but an editorial comment.

Have you tried asking Mitchell? He won't provide anything. The article was not only written with the claim (in the title) that he has "vital evidence to prove the deniers wrong" but that article was linked on his university's web page for his profile. Also, the article was reposted a few months later, word-for-word identical to the original one in January but with the claim "Holocaust Archaeology Proves Deniers Wrong."

Do you have some theory about why they would be publishing articles about this guy, claiming he has archaeological evidence that proves "deniers" wrong when he actually doesn't? And if he does have such evidence, why hasn't he shown it to the world?

[NFrNJ]

the photo I showed him -- a screenshot from a video with a PowerPoint presentation -- contained bones from other part of the camp. The rabbi told him to move these bones collected over the course of years to be placed into one single pit for a photograph. That's not something you would ever assume, I'm surprised he admitted it.

this comment also suggests you do not understand how archaeologists work. Why are you surprised he told you this? (why do you say "admitted" - he was not accused of anything. that is prejudicial language, suggestive of your distrust, not of his ill doing.)

You took a slide out of context, not knowing what it showed. He told you what it showed, because you were saying things that you had just made up about it, and not telling the truth. He corrected you, told you the truth. A truth he has not (as far as you can prove) concealed. He has not(to my knowledge, and you have not shown that he has) ever lied about it.

Because archaeologists are devoted to discovery and publication of the truth. He would undoubtedly have always said, and has recorded, that some of the bones interred were from other places, and may well have left a marker in the grave for future archaeologists to know that these bones have been excavated before and are out of context if they excavate them again.

So if anyone is making an admission here it is you - admitting you used it out of context, assumed untrue things, probably spread misinformation without telling people you had no idea what the photo actually showed, and that it was you that was not doing due diligence and proper research.

Pretending that he was telling lies when it was just you assuming things is a pretty poor show.

[Lamprecht]

this comment also suggests you do not understand how archaeologists work. Why are you surprised he told you this? (why do you say "admitted" - he was not accused of anything. that is prejudicial language, suggestive of your distrust, not of his ill doing.)

Clearly it was an attempt to make the mass grave look like it contained more remains than it actually did

You took a slide out of context, not knowing what it showed. He told you what it showed, because you were saying things that you had just made up about it, and not telling the truth. He corrected you, told you the truth. A truth he has not (as far as you can prove) concealed. He has not(to my knowledge, and you have not shown that he has) ever lied about it.

Yes, I assumed that all of the remains in that pit were actually from the pit. The truth was that the remains shown in that pit (not even 0.1% of the alleged remains claimed to be at the site) weren't all actually from that pit. Instead, they were gathered over the course of years and then placed into the pit for a photograph.

Because archaeologists are devoted to discovery and publication of the truth.

There are good and bad people in every profession. Some mechanics are crooks that will tell you all sorts of things wrong with your car to get you to pay them for unnecessary fixes. Others are honest. Some police officers are good people only looking out for their community (even if they make mistakes) and some are corrupt. You would be a fool to trust anyone based on their profession.

He would undoubtedly have always said, and has recorded, that some of the bones interred were from other places, and may well have left a marker in the grave for future archaeologists to know that these bones have been excavated before and are out of context if they excavate them again.

That didn't show up in the reports.

So if anyone is making an admission here it is you - admitting you used it out of context, assumed untrue things, probably spread misinformation without telling people you had no idea what the photo actually showed, and that it was you that was not doing due diligence and proper research.

But clearly, I did post the photo, then I found the video that it was taken from (it wasn't in English and the person that originally posted the photo linked to an incorrect video), and then I asked the guy about it and got the answer. Nobody else did this as far as I am aware. You're the one "not doing due diligence and proper research" if anyone.

Pretending that he was telling lies when it was just you assuming things is a pretty poor show.

Quote where I was "pretending that he was telling lies"
Are we now supposed to assume that every photograph of an alleged mass grave at a so-called "extermination camp" is a carefully manufactured photo-op?

Because from the guidelines I have read, they do not say to do this:
Mass grave excavation guidelines / The "Mass grave excavations don't produce photographed bodies" lie:
viewtopic.php?t=12889

Can you find any guidelines that say something like
"place all of the scattered remains you found on the site over the years into one of the mass graves, and then photograph it at an angle that makes it appear larger than it actually is"
Really? I didn't read anything like that.

[borjastick]

Because archaeologists are devoted to discovery and publication of the truth.

NFJ chappie

Have you seen the Sturdy Colls television extravaganza on Treblinka??? They were not looking for the truth and certainly did not tell the truth. In fact it was a complete set-up job to make what flimsy evidence they could muster fit the official narrative.

Now, about the solid evidence from Mitchell which will prove us deniers wrong, how's it all going then?

[NFrNJ]

to the mods, if you don't want a discussion of the concepts, or questions asked about the claims of deniers, why has this place got the words "open debate" in the title?

I wrote a well argues analysis of the arguments being put forward. you are censoring me for not joining in the echo chamber and asking hard questions of the moronic crowd

[Moderator]

to the mods, if you don't want a discussion of the concepts, or questions asked about the claims of deniers, why has this place got the words "open debate" in the title?

I wrote a well argues analysis of the arguments being put forward. you are censoring me for not joining in the echo chamber and asking hard questions of the moronic crowd

"Censorship" not. You're dodging challenges and cannot keep posting in threads where you've been challenged on what YOU claim, as my note to you states. Besides that, your childish off topic responses seemed desperately shrill & riddled with ad hominem. That's on you.
see:
note to NFrNJ / challenges to your claims of massive human remains
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=13699
M1