Holocaust Summary

[Hegwood]

Would it be possible to prominently present someplace on this forum a Holocaust summary? Not a summary of whether there was any National Socialist plan to exterminate the Jews nor any other intangible but just a summary of the alleged murders. The where, when, and how of this supposed crime.

The stated purpose of this website is to promote open discussion of

one historical event called "Holocaust,"

but I can find no further explanation of the event details.

When I sought to learn the reality of the Holocaust, the first question was "Where, when, and how were six million jews killed?" No one had a ready answer, not the United States Holocaust Memorial and Museum, not Wikipedia, not major encyclopedias, and not this site. The information for individual events may exist, but I wasn't going to spend days digging out this information. Ultimately, while watching the "One Third of the Holocaust" video I did find what I was looking for. It was an extract from Hilberg's Destruction of the European Jews .

I am sure other first time investigators of the truth about the Holocaust have had the same problem. It would be good if this site could provide this summary.

It is certainly no accident that USHMM and Wikipedia do not provide this summary. Once the details of the story are known the lies become obvious. An identification of the where, when, and how's of the alleged crime is the first step to exposing these details.

[Hannover]

Hegwood said:

The stated purpose of this website is to promote open discussion of

one historical event called "Holocaust,"

but I can find no further explanation of the event details.

Surely you are not serious. This site represents the best database for debunking 'holocaust' details one could possibly want.
Use our search function and start looking. If you are still confused then start asking questions in new threads, read the guidelines first.

Timelines are readily available on the internet, as absurdly fictitious as they are.
basic Google search 'holocaust timeline':
http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/h ... eline.html

- Hannover

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists demand censorship. What sort of truth is it that crushes the freedom to seek the truth? Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.

The tide is turning.

[borjastick]

Here's a ready reckoner to conjure with:

Auschwitz 4m
Treblinka 900,000
Einsatzgruppen 2m
Majdanek 1.7m
Belsen, Buchenwald 150,000
Other camps inc Sobibor, Belzec, Chelmno 500,000
Ghettos 400,000?
Dachau 30,000?
Others 500,000
Total = 10m+++ Woops!

If you haven't read it try Dalton's Debating the Holocaust. It's a wonderful piece and dissects the claims logically and with great clarity by use of tables and analysis of timelines and graphs. Well worth having in one's collection.

[Kingfisher]

Here's a ready reckoner to conjure with:

Auschwitz 4m
Treblinka 900,000
Einsatzgruppen 2m
Majdanek 1.7m
Belsen, Buchenwald 150,000
Other camps inc Sobibor, Belzec, Chelmno 500,000
Ghettos 400,000?
Dachau 30,000?
Others 500,000
Total = 10m+++ Woops!

Shouldn't that be Treblinka 3M? (Vassili Grossman)

[borjastick]

Here's a ready reckoner to conjure with:

Auschwitz 4m
Treblinka 900,000
Einsatzgruppen 2m
Majdanek 1.7m
Belsen, Buchenwald 150,000
Other camps inc Sobibor, Belzec, Chelmno 500,000
Ghettos 400,000?
Dachau 30,000?
Others 500,000
Total = 10m+++ Woops!

Shouldn't that be Treblinka 3M? (Vassili Grossman)

Yes Kingfisher it's really a game of pick a number and make the others up as you go along. The claims of the death toll directly due to the holocaust are bizarre to say the least and none, yes NOT ONE has been scientifically proved. Even the numbers within Belsen and Buchenwald, where one could reasonably expect some accurate info given that they were enclosed camps with the allies managing them at the end of the war, are vague. When it comes to the Aktion Reinhardt camps the numbers are in my opinion completely false.

[Hektor]

Here's a ready reckoner to conjure with:

Auschwitz 4m
Treblinka 900,000
Einsatzgruppen 2m
Majdanek 1.7m
Belsen, Buchenwald 150,000
Other camps inc Sobibor, Belzec, Chelmno 500,000
Ghettos 400,000?
Dachau 30,000?
Others 500,000
Total = 10m+++ Woops!

Shouldn't that be Treblinka 3M? (Vassili Grossman)

That would make it 12 mil. Holocaustians don't insist that all of their postulated victims were Jews. That's why they conjure up a figure like:"The Nazis murdered 11.million" people. The trick there is to add another 5 million to the 6 million Jews. That would still let the Jews standout as unique victims with the 5 million carved up among "3 million non-Jewish Poles", 500.000 Gypsies, 200.000 Homosexuals, Leaving a bit more then a million for all kind of other victims most prominently featured Communists. All of this is concocted of course with no base in reality, except that such people may indeed have been arrested at some stage under National Socialism.

I also read figures like 20.000.000, but I think they added stuff into that or just inflated other fictional numbers.

[Hegwood]

Hannover said;

Hegwood said:

The stated purpose of this website is to promote open discussion of

one historical event called "Holocaust,"

but I can find no further explanation of the event details.

Surely you are not serious. This site represents the best database for debunking 'holocaust' details one could possibly want.
Use our search function and start looking. If you are still confused then start asking questions in new threads, read the guidelines first.

Timelines are readily available on the internet, as absurdly fictitious as they are.
basic Google search 'holocaust timeline':
http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/h ... eline.html 

I take it from his response Hannover also could not find a short description of this "event called the Holocaust."

Borjastick's response indicates that he at least understands what I was searching for. He identifies the camps/action where the killing is alleged to have happened but he doesn't seem to be serious.

Hegwood

[Hannover]

Hegwood says:

I take it from his response Hannover also could not find a short description of this "event called the Holocaust."

Borjastick's response indicates that he at least understands what I was searching for. He identifies the camps/action where the killing is alleged to have happened but he doesn't seem to be serious.

Here you go, the impossible 'holocaust' storyline spoon fed to you in an incredibly short format from the notoriously Zionist controlled Wikipedia *:

The Holocaust (from the Greek ὁλόκαυστος holókaustos: hólos, "whole" and kaustós, "burnt"),[2] also known as the Shoah (Hebrew: השואה, HaShoah, "the catastrophe"), was a genocide in which approximately six million Jews were killed by Adolf Hitler's Nazi regime and its collaborators.[3] Some historians use a definition of the Holocaust that includes the additional five million non-Jewish victims of Nazi mass murders, bringing the total to approximately eleven million. Killings took place throughout Nazi Germany and German-occupied territories.[4]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust

* see:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8652
racist 'Jewish Internet Defense Force' manipulates

Now what?

- Hannover

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists demand censorship. What sort of truth is it that crushes the freedom to seek the truth? Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.

The tide is turning.

[Hegwood]

My initial reaction is "I give up, you're to obstinate for me", but perhaps "obsinate" is too strong of a word. I did not necessarily expect you to automatically accept my suggestion. but I did expect a civil response.
But I do give up.

Hegwood

[borjastick]

Borjastick's response indicates that he at least understands what I was searching for. He identifies the camps/action where the killing is alleged to have happened but he doesn't seem to be serious.

- Hegwood

Oh but I was being serious as these figures were/are what we are supposed to believe. These figures are the official ones which all us stupid people are meant to buy into and believe without question or investigation. That's why they may look so silly and not serious. Precisely because they are ridiculous and beyond belief and perhaps more important they have never been scientifically proven or backed up with demographic proof.

Simply put when one looks at what me and Hannover have provided the summary of the claimed Holocaust is clearly implausible at best.

I also stand by my very serious suggestion that you purchase a copy of Thomas Dalton's Debating The Holocaust. It is packed full of summaries which will satisfy anyone.

[Hegwood]

In a recent discussion on the holocaust with my brother he stated he would rather believe the American and British troops who were there and reported on what they saw rather than believe holocaust deniers.

My response was that he did not know the Holocaust story. If he did he would know that the American and British forces were not "there". American and British troops never got closer than 400 miles to the physical setting of the more significant sites of the holocaust story. Also according to the story line, it ended months before they ever reached Germany.

I had to provide him the major parts of Raul Hilberg's tabulation of alleged holocaust victims by camp or action as shown below to explain to him what the holocaust story was and point out it all took place in Eastern Europe miles from that part of Germany occupied by the Western allies.

The few thousand dead inmates that the Americans and British found in the German labor camps were an insignificant portion of the alleged jewish genocide. Furthermore, none of those inmates were intentionally killed. They were overwhelmingly the victims of disease.

The object of this post is to show how much easier it is to expose the holocaust lie once just a rudimentary knowledge of the overall holocaust story is known. I believe that preservation of the lie is accomplished by presenting in as a mish-mash of place names and horror stories without ever connecting them. Let's change that.

I again ask the managers of this site to prominently place a further definition of the holocaust in the form of a brief summary of where, when, and how the Germans allegedly killed six million Jews.

Note that in the following the great propaganda names - Dachau, Buchenwald, Bergen-Belsen - get lost in the details. Hilberg's table groups these names with others in a parenthetical summary of others.

The following is the summary the Holocaust story that I provided my brother:
Action Reinhardt Camps.......Treblinka(750,000), Belsec (550,000), Sobibor(200,000) - 1,500,000
Einsatzgruppen (killings by shooting)................................................................................ - 1,300,000
Auschwitz............................................................................................................................. - 1,000,000
Ghettoization (deaths due to conditions in Ghettos).................................................... - 800,000
Majdanek and Chelmno.................................................................................................... - 200,000
Deaths in other East Europe camps................................................................................ - 150,000
Deaths in labor camps in Germany................................................................................. - 150,000

[borjastick]

I totally agree Hegwood.

It's also interesting how many people justify our involvement in the war based on the claims of the jews and their holocaust, which only came to light after the war. The holocaust had nothing whatsoever to do with the US and Britain entering a war with Germany, but people say because of the holocaust claims 'yeah but that Hitler was a monster, a terrible and evil man'.

[Hektor]

I totally agree Hegwood.

It's also interesting how many people justify our involvement in the war based on the claims of the jews and their holocaust, which only came to light after the war. The holocaust had nothing whatsoever to do with the US and Britain entering a war with Germany, but people say because of the holocaust claims 'yeah but that Hitler was a monster, a terrible and evil man'.

It's a post-(supposed)-facto justification. Initially Britain's declaration of war was the invasion of Poland by the German Wehrmacht, which the (educated) British knew very well, wasn't exactly unprovoked. There were still offers to settle the conflict peacefully from the German side. But that would essential left Germany strong, even if their most moderate offer would be accepted. It would also still allow for a sober view on the economic and social policies and practices in Germany. So it went on. Now at Nuremberg they claimed that Germany attacked Poland under the pretext of the Gleiwitz incident supposedly a false flag operation initiated by the Germans. Just that it wasn't neither pretext for justification, nor is there really good evidence for this being a false flag operation. The British themselves didn't trust their crown witness for this. Now imagine British, American and French investigative journalists and those having been opposed to the war taking a deeper look in the causalities and actions by the states involved in the war - driving to the conclusion that it could have been avoided by the (Western) Allied side. Very inconvenient for a substantial portion of the elites to say the least.

How convenient that they "discovered" and drew attention to "the Holocaust". Of course they already had made a monster out of Hitler. And there were heavy accusation against the German occupational forces, especially against the Gestapo. Bear in mind that those have been made trade name. But this easily could have been declared war time measures with some unfortunate side effects. And why did Germany invade plus occupy those countries in the first place? Ah, yes. Hitler wanted to conquer the world! Another lie that's easily debunked. So it had to be a Holocaust of six million completely innocent Jews, mainly performed with gas chambers in camps specially erected for this purpose. Before you say: But even the German government and historians all agree that it is true, please consider that they may have similar motives to the Allies that installed them as post-war elites.

[Hegwood]

I am preoccupied and can not keep up with any ongoing conversations much less respond to any posts at the time. I'll be back to civilization in a few weeks and see if I have something new to add then.
Thanks to all for the replies to xzw

Hegwood

[Hektor]

"Faith is believing what you know ain't so"
-- Mark Twain

Actually Faith is having an inner certainty in what you believe, something that isn't easily shaken. Knowledge is justified true believe.

Holocaustian seem to have neither. They can't justify their believe in the Holocaust with facts and rational argumentation always playing on innuendo and emotion. And their hysterical reactions to those questioning the narrative, nay even making threats of violence and in some countries government violence against dissenters shows me that they ain't that certain of their story.