Question about Holocaust Revisionism ?

[bobsmith1800s]

My question I was talking to someone once about the subject, of Holocaust Revisionism. I said that I read that the reason why the Jews were dying in the Concentration Camps and in the Ghettos was because the War Germany was' being Bombed and the, Supply Lines were cut off lack of Food and Medicine. and their reply to me was that than how did the Germans get the Jews in the Camps they said' in 1944 and 1945 that there were, Jews being shipped on the Trains to, the Camps is there any answer to that reply thank you for your time today ?

[Hektor]

That is true for the last phase of warm war in 1944/45. But the matter may be different with camps and ghettoes prior to this.

A major war would of course be a disruption of commerce and industry as well. People losing jobs and goods becoming scarce. So many people will suffer shortages that can lead to malnutrition, losing your home, not be able to afford hygiene and medical care, etc. It also leads to more friction.

From records it appears that the food in the camps was OK most of the time. There were also other facilities.

[hermod]

their reply to me was that than how did the Germans get the Jews in the Camps they said' in 1944 and 1945 that there were, Jews being shipped on the Trains to, the Camps. is there any answer to that reply?

Evacuations on foot. Holocaust believers call those difficult pedestrian evacuations "the death marches."

There were also evacuations by train when and where still possible, but the evacuees' travel time was considerably lengthened by the poor condition of the railway tracks, what of course increased the impairment of the evacuees and the number of deaths during those evacuations. A notorious example of that is the so-called “death train” found by the American soldiers who captured Dachau. That train had taken over 3 weeks to travel 220 miles from the Buchenwald camp because some Allied planes had bombed the railroad tracks. No need to explain that the Dachau "death train" was of course used by U.S. syke warriors for atrocity propaganda purposes in order to show the Americans why they had fought.

https://www.45thinfantrydivision.com/45thdiv1.jpg

https://www.45thinfantrydivision.com/45thdiv3.jpg

As the rightmost company of the 3rd Battalion, 157th Infantry (aboard tanks and trucks) approached the Amper River near Dachau Lager, the only bridge in the area was blown up. The company then began to follow the river to the southwest (toward the town of Dachau) looking for an undamaged bridge. In the meantime, the Battalion Commander, Lt. Col. Felix L.Sparks, directed Company I to move into the town of Dachau also, and to try to locate a bridge. Ultimately, a railroad bridge was found to have been partially destroyed. Foot troops and light vehicles, but not tanks or trucks, could cross. Company I was directed to cross the bridge and then to head back to the northeast, basically to get back to the point where the destroyed bridge had halted the advance. Colonel Sparks and a couple of his radio operators accompanied Company I.

Company I crossed the bridge, came upon a railroad spur leading to the northeast, and followed it to the southwestern gate to Dachau Lager. On that spur, but outside the Lager, the men came across the first railroad cars of what would become known as the Death Train. There were several cars in this train, and part of the train extended through the railroad gage and into the Lager. Sickened, shocked and enraged by the sight of several hundred emaciated, brutalized, dead prisoners in and around the rail cars, the men of Company I, 157th Infantry followed the rail line and the parallel road deeper into Dachau Lager.

Although it is known that the three platoons of Company I moved off in different directions once they entered the Lager, the actual routes of advance within the complex and the times of subsequent events have been lost to history. It is known that some of the men followed a rail spur leading generally toward the prisoner compound, that others continued farther along the main rail line before turning to the east, and that others initially were fully occupied in accepting the surrender of numerous German soldiers.

Inside Dachau Lager, but long before the prisoner compound had been discovered, the 45th Division men began to round up dozens of surrendering German soldiers. Those who could be readily identified as SS men, were separated from the others and were collected in a walled area of the coal yard for the Lager’s power house. There, under conditions that are still clouded in mystery, several Americans opened fire on the SS men, killing about 17 of them and wounding several more. Colonel Sparks, who was nearby, heard the firing and rushed into the area and by force of his presence stopped the killing.

At some time after the men of Company I had cleared the Death Train, but probably before the shooting in the coal yard, three jeeps, (or four – or five – depending upon whether Sergeant Furst’s jeep, containing Furst and Maggie Higgins, preceded, accompanied or followed this group, and whether or not the jeep carrying the two Belgian correspondents Algoet and Levy was there, too) carrying members of the 42nd Division headquarters encountered the train. This party had been in Dachau town, purportedly attempting to find elements of one of the divisions’s regiments, when they heard the concentration camp was nearby and set out to locate it. (In fact, there may have been as many as seven jeeps in this group, as recent research by 42nd Division veterans indicates that two jeeps carrying six men from one of the regiments tagged on to the end of the convoy.)

The 42nd Division group halted briefly to examine the Death Train, then turned east and drove down the road paralleling the southern wall of Dachau Lager. About one-half mile down this road, the party arrived at the main gate to the Lager, which was decked out with white flags. A Red Cross representative and a couple of SS men came out of the gate carrying white flags and surrendered the camp to General Linden.

[...]

Soldiers smelled death

About a mile from the barbed wire, 27-year-old Lt. Col. Felix Sparks received a call on his military radio.

"You are to proceed immediately to the concentration camp at Dachau. Once inside, you are to secure it and let nobody in or out."

By the end of April 1945, Sparks and the 157th Infantry Regiment had slogged through thousands of miles, all the way from North Africa. At the end of the war, the 157th - which had it roots in the Colorado National Guard - spent more time in combat than almost any other unit.

On the afternoon of April 29, Sparks and his men smelled death. Then it glared back at them, from boxcars filled with bodies.

The trains had arrived from Buchenwald, where, weeks earlier, the Nazis had sent prisoners away in an attempt to hide them from the advancing Allies. Very few prisoners survived the trip. None survived Dachau.

At the edge of one of the railroad cars, Sparks saw the body of a man who managed to crawl a few feet from the train. A guard had crushed his head with a rifle butt.

As they passed each rail car, the soldiers' anger boiled. If they found the men who did this, a few swore, there would be hell to pay.

https://www.45thinfantrydivision.com/index14.htm

https://postimg.cc/k6HgM9XD

https://postimg.cc/xXjDZhnZ

https://postimg.cc/qzm8SxSB

After "reinterpretation" by Allied syke warriors:

https://postimg.cc/XXKH3Bh7

(syke warriors = workers of the Psychological Warfare Division (PWD) and similar services)

https://postimg.cc/3dhST7M5

[EtienneSC]

how did the Germans get the Jews in the Camps they said' in 1944 and 1945 that there were, Jews being shipped on the Trains to, the Camps is there any answer to that reply thank you for your time today ?

There is little divergence between the revisionists and scholars like Hilberg on the presence of Jews in camps and ghettoes. This is usually held to be part of a policy of isolation and concentration with a view to deportation on the part of the German government. The dispute is on the alleged change of policy in 1941 to one of extermination. The revisionists (and functionalists) claim that there was no such change (no such "Hitler order"). The received view is still that the change is evidenced by Einsatzgruppen executions after the invasion of the Soviet Union and later in various camps and on "death marches". The revisionists dispute this.

[Hektor]

their reply to me was that than how did the Germans get the Jews in the Camps they said' in 1944 and 1945 that there were, Jews being shipped on the Trains to, the Camps. is there any answer to that reply?

Evacuations on foot. Holocaust believers call those difficult pedestrian evacuations "the death marches."

There were also evacuations by train when and where still possible, but the evacuees' travel time was considerably lengthened by the poor condition of the railway tracks, what of course increased the impairment of the evacuees and the number of deaths during those evacuations. A notorious example of that is the so-called “death train” found by the American soldiers who captured Dachau. That train had taken over 3 weeks to travel 220 miles from the Buchenwald camp because some Allied planes had bombed the railroad tracks. No need to explain that the Dachau "death train" was of course used by U.S. syke warriors for atrocity propaganda purposes in order to show the Americans why they had fought.
.....

Evacuation onf Foot / 'Death Marches'
They indeed existed and I'd say that wasn't exactly easy to be on foot at the time. They had to walk long distances and there would be problems with accomodation / food / medical care on the way. And that's only, if you aren't attacked from the air, which isn't mentioned usually, of course. And well, I won't dispute that people have died on those marches... It is a perfectly plausible possibility. The Holocaustians won't to use the later to support the notion of 'extreme cruelty', but if you think about it: Why are there evacuation marches, if they could have killed the prisoners on the spot? Far easier then marching around a collapsing Germany and you can redeploy the guards as well.

The 'Death Train' is another juicy matter of course. Yes the bombing caused delays. And delays = less food, water, care, etc. That will increase mortality. But wasn't the train also subject to (Allied) air attacks. And wasn't it exactly those air attacks that killed most of those on the train?!

That's of course not told. And yes, the dead on the train were ideal material for the psychological warfare division to disseminate.
And dead folks on a train are of course ideal to get people jump to completely different conclusions. And hell, didn't they manage to do that.

The case of Nordhausen is a give-away. There isn't really much doubt about who bombed the place and who "killed the people". But it is presented as "Nazi atrocity". And if the Allies weren't so keen on the truth in this case, what about the others? They essentially altered the causal mechanism of death in other cases as well.

What has me puzzled is why the Americans had to stress the "Why we fight"-aspect so strongly relating to atrocity propaganda. Wasn't their official approach that they had been attacked by the Japanese first (supposedly without provocation) and that after all Germany/Axis had declared war on them. PLUS that they considered National Socialism as undemocratic and oppressive and that the occupation of the other countries was repressive and undemocratic? The 'extermination' camps should only be a convenient side story in this. After all, they didn't go to war for Germany with the claim that there are 'extermination camps'... For which they couldn't have certain knowledge anyway. In fact it seems internally this wasn't really taken serious anyway.

I'd guess the problem was really that the leadership realized that people could find out that the dead in the concentration camps were actually the result of Allied warfare methods against Germany. So rather spin an extermination story so nobody starts seriously arguing about this. Meaning that this is actually a 'shut up' debate-tactic writ-large.